sasukamu:saayaway a belih
Number of pages
[mikawaway tu kalumyiti sakatizeng bangu]Hi Reke. You have changed the counter on main page from "numberofarticles" to "numberofpages". Wouldn't it be better to show the number of articles as it is done in nearly all other Wikipedias? Best regards --Holder ( sasukamu ) 2019年12月5日 (sakasepat a demied nu lipay) 03:12 (CST)
- Note that the number was changed but not the rest of the statement, so it's (also) important whether "Izawaytu ku […] nu ulic niyam." — added in this edit by misaungayay:曾祥宇 — refers to articles or pages. I don't know which it is, since I don't read the language. (I agree with Holder that it should refer to articles.) Also, since szy doesn't automatically capitalize the first word of sentences, shouldn't the statement actually begin with a lowercase "i"? - dcljr ( sasukamu ) 2019年12月5日 (sakasepat a demied nu lipay) 14:30 (CST)
- Another user has changed the page in the ways being discussed here. - dcljr ( sasukamu ) 2019年12月5日 (sakasepat a demied nu lipay) 18:02 (CST)
Should we create an embassy page just like other Wikipedias? --TongcyDai ( sasukamu ) 2019年12月6日 (sakalima a demied nu lipay) 16:29 (CST)
撒奇萊雅語標準書寫是句首和字首都是"小寫"，只有專有名詞，如人名、地名才會大寫，如果不是這種情況句首大寫是錯誤的，可能是書寫者用microsoft word 打字時，被自動修改的，所以請勿改為自動大寫。謝謝!
我們是否應該對某些命名空間的大小寫敏感度進行調整？／Should we make some adjustments to some namespaces' case-sensativeness?
[mikawaway tu kalumyiti sakatizeng bangu]由於我不會說撒奇萊雅語，以下的內容將以中文和英語描述，請見諒。
從此處的資料得知，當今撒奇萊雅語維基百科大多數的命名空間都是「case-sensitive」，也就是「區分大小寫的」。這意味著該頁面首字母的大小寫若不同，會被視為不同的頁面名稱，如「Saayaway a belih」和「saayaway a belih」是兩個不同的頁面。目前不區分大小寫的命名空間只有「特殊／sazumaay」、「使用者／misaungayay」（及其討論頁）、「MediaWiki／MyitiWyici」（及其討論頁）。這乃是為了和撒奇萊雅語的書寫習慣（或正寫法）一致而訂定的，但是這亦會造成一些麻煩。由於「模板／taazihan mitudung」和「模組／bacu-saupu」區分大小寫，當用戶加入新的模板或模組時，他們必須要手動將它們的名稱都轉為小寫，這樣才符合正寫法。但是，許多從中文維基百科導入的模板和模組（例如bacu-saupu:Arguments、bacu-saupu:String等等）都已經使用了大寫作為開頭，要使用者記住哪些頁面該用大寫開頭、哪些使用小寫開頭幾乎是不可能的事，手動為所有模板和模組加入重定向頁面也不是有效率的方法；甚者，這個問題可能會影響日後的維護工作。
綜上，我建議將「模板／taazihan mitudung」和「模組／bacu-saupu」從 case-sensitive 改為 first-letter（第一個字母自動轉為大寫），以解決以上的問題。先前我曾和創建撒奇萊雅語百科的 Jon Harald Søby 討論過這件事（記錄請見此），他建議我先到社群詢問大家的意見，若社群同意的話再進行修改。還請各位不吝提出意見。TongcyDai（sasukamu） 2020年2月17日 (sakacacay a demied nu lipay) 22:28 (CST)
- @Corainn、Padakaw、Buting.nukay、Kimli isin、Sabak5388：、@Sabak Tutuy、黃金文、Hana ating、Kimli miku、海螺先生：非常抱歉打擾各位，請您們撥冗查看上方的文字，如果可以的話請在下方留下意見（使用中文即可）。TongcyDai（sasukamu） 2020年2月17日 (sakacacay a demied nu lipay) 22:33 (CST)
- Approximate English Translation: According to this page, most namespaces in Sakizaya Wikipedia are "case-sensitive", which means that if the case of the first letter of the page is different, it will be treated as different pages. For example, "Saayaway a belih" and "saayaway a belih" are two different pages. Currently, the only case-insensitive namespaces are "Special" (sazumaay), "User" (misaungayay, along with its talk page), and "MediaWiki" (MyitiWyici, along with its talk page). This was set to be consistent with the writing habits (orthography) of Sakizaya, but it also caused some trouble. Since "Template" (taazihan mitudung) and "Module" (bacu-saupu) are case-sensitive, when users add new templates or modules, they must manually convert pagenames into lowercase in order to conform to the orthography. However, many templates and modules imported from Chinese Wikipedia have already used uppercase for their first letter in their names (such as bacu-saupu:Arguments and bacu-saupu:String), and it is almost impossible for users to remember which pages should start with uppercase and which should start with lowercase. For sure, manually adding redirect pages to all templates and modules is not an efficient method either. What's worse, this problem may affect maintenance work in the future.
- In summary, I suggest changing "Template" (taazihan mitudung) and "Module" (bacu-saupu) from "case-sensitive" to "first-letter" (the first letter is automatically capitalized) to solve the problems above. I have previously discussed this with Jon Harald Søby, who created the szywiki (see here for the discussion), and he suggested that I go to the community and ask for your opinions, and see if there is agreement in the community. Please comment below. TongcyDai（sasukamu） 2020年2月17日 (sakacacay a demied nu lipay) 23:59 (CST)
- I am not an active member of this community since I do not read Sakizaya, but couldn't (/shouldn't) the imported templates and modules simply be moved to proper Sakizaya titles after they are imported (which would leave redirects, anyway, unless this is specifically suppressed)? Yes, this is annoying to do "manually", but such work is often required to adapt each wiki to editors in the local language. (In particular, what I'm saying is, keeping the pages at their original English [or Chinese, etc.] titles — however capitalized — would disadvantage Sakizaya users who do not know those languages. This is supposed to be a Wikipedia in Sakizaya, after all.) Also, apart from the tedium of creating them in the first place, I don't see a problem with keeping a bunch of redirects around to help contributors with less knowledge of relevant languages. I haven't been able to verify that redirects "work" in the Module namespace as they do in the Template namespace, but I assume they do. - dcljr（sasukamu） 2020年2月18日 (sakatusa a demied nu lipay) 10:01 (CST)
- Thank you for your opinions! Here are some of my ideas. First, setting those namespaces as "first-letter" will not affect those who use lowercase in page names, it will just bring greater efficiency when we create/import new templates and modules, especially the intricate ones. (To be clear, I don't want those elder editors be responsible for these annoying problems that can be easily solved by changing the settings. And case-redirects is no longer needed if we change the settings!) Also, I want to mention, the only difference between Sakizaya orthography (as I referred above) and English orthography is that Sakizaya don't capitalize the first letter of every sentence, so changing these two namespaces to "first-letter" should have nothing to do with orthography — we still keep the main (and other) namespaces case-sensative! Second, though it has few to do with the topic, keeping the pages at their original titles should be totally fine, you can see many most-frequently-used templates and modules' names are in English in all wikiprojects (for example, Template:Commonscat and so) — if some users really want/need a local name for it, just create a redirect page. TongcyDai（sasukamu） 2020年2月18日 (sakatusa a demied nu lipay) 15:00 (CST)
- I am not an active member of this community since I do not read Sakizaya, but couldn't (/shouldn't) the imported templates and modules simply be moved to proper Sakizaya titles after they are imported (which would leave redirects, anyway, unless this is specifically suppressed)? Yes, this is annoying to do "manually", but such work is often required to adapt each wiki to editors in the local language. (In particular, what I'm saying is, keeping the pages at their original English [or Chinese, etc.] titles — however capitalized — would disadvantage Sakizaya users who do not know those languages. This is supposed to be a Wikipedia in Sakizaya, after all.) Also, apart from the tedium of creating them in the first place, I don't see a problem with keeping a bunch of redirects around to help contributors with less knowledge of relevant languages. I haven't been able to verify that redirects "work" in the Module namespace as they do in the Template namespace, but I assume they do. - dcljr（sasukamu） 2020年2月18日 (sakatusa a demied nu lipay) 10:01 (CST)
- @TongcyDai Support, although I don't have enough knowledge of Taiwanese languages, I think making this change can actually fix many code-based problems, need to check conflicts before merging of related patches. --Liuxinyu970226（sasukamu） 2021年3月3日 (sakatulu a demied nu lipay) 12:41 (CST)